Good standardized test takers? - Gifted Issues Discussion Forum

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#144542 - 12/14/12 05:25 PM Good standardized test takers? Member Registered: 03/22/09 Posts: 184 In the 7th grade, DD(atthetime13) got Duke TIP Grand Recognition for her SAT score. DD(now17) got back her junior PSAT results a few days ago, and was one question away from a perfect score (and she was rushing and misread the one that she missed- it was a VERY simple math question). I would think that perfect scores are not extremely uncommon, but a google search yielded that only 100 or so students get it a year, which makes me think that her score is probably in the upper 99th percentile, which would be considered "HG." It took the school system until the end of the 5th grade to figure out that she was gifted, and while I now have no doubt that she is gifted, highly gifted seems like a bit of a stretch. She does what it takes to make decent grades, but not "amazing" grades. She really has no subject that she is amazingly skilled at, but instead is equally good at everything. When she got her PSAT scores back, she noticed that kids who have much better grades than her got much lower PSAT scores (and she didn't prepare much for the PSAT, so I don't think that was the difference). So I'm just wondering, are some people just really good at standardized tests? When she took a diagnostic PSAT that the school offered having not studied at all, she got a 234, so I don't think her score on the actual test was inflated because she went to a few PSAT classes at the school... And if she is able to score so high on the PSAT, should we be expecting all A's? Or is that just unreasonable since she is in hard classes and is working fairly hard? DH scored way lower on his tests yet was valedictorian, so maybe he is just basing his expectations on that? (don't worry, we are proud of her no matter what, but when she gets near perfect scores like these, we wonder what amazing things she could do if she worked harder) Edited by Bassetlover (12/14/12 05:45 PM) Top

#144543 - 12/14/12 06:13 PM Re: Good standardized test takers? [Re: Bassetlover] Member Registered: 07/20/12 Posts: 162 reading this ... boredom comes to mind. Is she at all interested in the classes she's taking? Also ... form my own experience ... lower grades may be a "defense system" for her. I was always stressing over getting straight As when I was in elementary and middle school. Getting a C ONCE was the end of the world for me! In high school I one day figured told myself that the world does NOT end with getting grades other than As and let myself miss questions, didn't stress over every little test ... I realized that NOT having As all the time made me happier when I DID in fact get them and people's expectations around me were lower so I actually got praised for good grades rather than my parents and everyone else saying "what else is new?" when I kept straight As all the time. ... I hope this makes sense? Not sure if that applies in your daughter's case but it might be something to consider? Top

#144548 - 12/14/12 08:04 PM Re: Good standardized test takers? [Re: Bassetlover] Member Registered: 09/29/11 Posts: 909 It took the school system until the end of the 5th grade to figure out that she was gifted, and while I now have no doubt that she is gifted, highly gifted seems like a bit of a stretch. I suspect you're thinking of "highly gifted" as equating with high academic achievement in traditional schools (which is often how it's defined by educators too :)). There really isn't any rule of nature that says people with extremely high ability are also going to be the highest achiever in school or that the highest achievers are always the students with the highest ability. There is more that plays into high achievement in school than simply ability - motivation, passion, caring about grades, having certain types of academic strengths etc. Sometimes the highest ability children are simply going to be bored in regular school and not care about their grades. Sometimes the not-quite-so-highest-ability kids are going to be so driven by their personality type that they will achieve great things. I am not a testing expert, but I believe the PSAT, and the SAT, both have components of the test that are dependent on ability, not achievement in school - so it's not going to be so terribly easy for a student who is simply getting great grades to score super-high on either if they don't also have high ability - so I think it's more than likely that your dd is HG and has some pretty amazing intellectual abilities Maybe she just hasn't found what she's passionate about yet. Congrats to your dd on her great scores!!! polarbear Top

#144554 - 12/14/12 09:03 PM Re: Good standardized test takers? [Re: Bassetlover] Member Registered: 03/22/09 Posts: 184 Thanks for taking time to respond! @Mk13- yes, I do think she has a philosophy similar to that. She tries hard to get the best grades that she can, but she definitely isn't scared of getting a B if it is a very hard class... @polarbear- that's true. I think one problem DD has is that she does not work on assignments over time. If a reading is due, she will do it the night before. If she needs to study, she will do it the night before, etc. I'm sure that this does hurt her grades a bit and I'm sure a lot of the kids with higher grades are better about this. (though I know that this is a problem that plagues many if not even most students). I think you are right about not having an area she is passionate about yet, because I don't even know if she has just one. She's the kind of person that will, cook an amazing meal (she's vegetarian so doesn't eat the food that I cook), then compose a song on the piano, then read for a few minutes and get bored, work on homework for a few minutes, watch TV, finish up homework, finish a crossword puzzle in 10 minutes, offer to go to the grocery store, etc, all in the span of a few hours. She is forever on the move and isn't really a fan of staying in one place for a long time, physically or mentally. I wouldn't call her the traditionally "nerdy" kid who is always reading, because honestly, she doesn't want to sit still for that long... In the same way, she loves learning about anything, for a few days. And then she wants to learn about something else, and so on and so forth. Top

#144555 - 12/14/12 09:31 PM Re: Good standardized test takers? [Re: Bassetlover] Member Registered: 02/05/11 Posts: 905 Loc: West Coast USA Yes, I do think that there is such a thing as a savant ability to take standardized tests. I'm living proof. I was what could (only very charitably) be termed an "indifferent" student throughout high school-- and my GPA showed it. Oh, sure-- I am 'gifted.' I'm HG, in fact. But I had a 2.4 GPA. (Er-- or thereabouts. I'm not sure, but I definitely had a few grades LOWER than "C" on that transcript.) But still-- every standardized exam I've ever taken I've hit a home run with. The same way that you've reported-- the kind of "WOW!!" performance that seems completely incongruous with the rest of the person everyone knows. National Merit Semi-finalist (easily making the cut), etc. My DD is a natural test-taker, too. She just flies on the adrenaline, I think. I don't know enough about her internal landscape to tell you what is going on in her head. But I can tell you that I'm someone who enters a flow state during standardized exams. I'm just seriously in the zone-- it's showtime, I guess. Like I'm working the NYT crossword puzzle, or the world's biggest Sudoku or something. It just FEELS like play while I'm doing it. It's a rush. I'd take the GRE every day just for fun, basically. I liked it that much. I'm not really "that smart" if you were to meet me and talk to me, though. I just happen to enjoy taking standardized exams, and-- well, whatever a HG person tends to pursue that way, they tend to be pretty extraordinarily good at, too, YK? Congrats to her on the excellent score, by the way! _________________________ There's nothing like a loose howler monkey for granting one the gift of living in the moment. Top

#144563 - Yesterday at 06:53 AM Re: Good standardized test takers? [Re: HowlerKarma] Member Registered: 04/16/10 Posts: 1190 But I can tell you that I'm someone who enters a flow state during standardized exams. I'm just seriously in the zone-- it's showtime, I guess. Like I'm working the NYT crossword puzzle, or the world's biggest Sudoku or something. It just FEELS like play while I'm doing it. It's a rush. I'd take the GRE every day just for fun, basically. I liked it that much. My DS10 is like this. He got a serious buzz from taking the EXPLORE in 4th grade. DeeDee Top

#144566 - Yesterday at 07:33 AM Re: Good standardized test takers? [Re: Bassetlover] Member Registered: 07/13/12 Posts: 231 Loc: NC Bassetlover, In reference to your daughter, you may enjoy reading about the scanner personality concept: http://getmotivation.com/articlelib/articles/barbara_sher_scanner.html It's an interesting concept and very descriptive of myself, too. I see some other similarities in your descriptions. It sounds like your daughter is very intrinsically motivated. One of the things to counter boredom particularly with a strong inner passion for learning is to have your own learning objectives in classes. Grades then very rarely reflect the actual learning, but rather reflect an alignment between the learner's learning objectives and the teacher's pedagogical objectives. Top

#144581 - Yesterday at 05:17 PM Re: Good standardized test takers? [Re: Bassetlover] Member Registered: 03/22/09 Posts: 184 @Zen Scanner- that link describes her so perfectly! It is definitely how my oldest son is, as well. Top

#144582 - Yesterday at 06:04 PM Re: Good standardized test takers? [Re: Bassetlover] Member Registered: 12/16/09 Posts: 403 "...are some people just really good at standardized tests?" Yes! My ex-H and I are two of them, and second D inherited this from us. None of us have great grades (ex-H was a serious slacker, I was around a 3.5 in high school and a 3.3 in college). But ex-H got into Georgetown Law on the strength of his LSATs (nearly perfect), in spite of slacker grades. D has an unweighted 3.7 in HS, but her SATs were 800-780-800, with 800 on two SAT subject tests. She kind of does what she has to in order to get at least an A- in most classes, pulls As in a few she really likes, doesn't do well at all in French which she hates. And she would rather study for Quiz Bowl or watch an episode of Sherlock for the 10th time than work any harder. Edited by intparent (Yesterday at 06:05 PM) Top

#144585 - Yesterday at 06:48 PM Re: Good standardized test takers? [Re: HowlerKarma] Member Registered: 06/25/12 Posts: 509 Loc: BC, Canada I was what could (only very charitably) be termed an "indifferent" student throughout high school-- and my GPA showed it. Oh, sure-- I am 'gifted.' I'm HG, in fact. But I had a 2.4 GPA. (Er-- or thereabouts. I'm not sure, but I definitely had a few grades LOWER than "C" on that transcript.) But still-- every standardized exam I've ever taken I've hit a home run with. The same way that you've reported-- the kind of "WOW!!" performance that seems completely incongruous with the rest of the person everyone knows. This is me too. I test in the "HG" range, and my grades in school were a direct reflection of my level of interest or lack thereof. I did fine on tests though. In fact, I love taking tests (my competitive side comes out, lol). Top

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